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Post by foxtrot27 on Jun 16, 2024 16:03:46 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? Interesting point. However, the challenge will be what happens next. A lot of confidence has been lost so any new league that includes the remaining clubs will still need funding. Also, with the new season about 3 months from tip-off, it feels very tight from a timing perspective. Unless the PR explaining the path forward for fans, TV, sponsors etc starts immediately, I can’t see how BBL 2.0 can raise investment and start marketing in time to pull off a proper reset. It wouldn’t hurt to take off a season and sort the issues of PR, finance and marketing properly. Rising into this will most certainly be extremely difficult. |
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Post by irf on Jun 16, 2024 16:37:03 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? Interesting point. However, the challenge will be what happens next. A lot of confidence has been lost so any new league that includes the remaining clubs will still need funding. Also, with the new season about 3 months from tip-off, it feels very tight from a timing perspective. Unless the PR explaining the path forward for fans, TV, sponsors etc starts immediately, I can’t see how BBL 2.0 can raise investment and start marketing in time to pull off a proper reset. It wouldn’t hurt to take off a season and sort the issues of PR, finance and marketing properly. Rising into this will most certainly be extremely difficult. I had wondered about taking a season off or maybe a delayed shorter season I'm expecting clubs might have to rebrand with new names One problem is there will be countless suppliers owed money both by bbl as a whole and existing clubs as normal And if clubs do have to liquidate to avoid bbl debts they cannot cover then they can't pick and choose what debts do get paid with what assets are left And we will be talking about big and small suppliers - many who have supported the clubs for decades in some cases Plus venues Liquidators would decide what debts if any get paid. They cant just pay the non 777 debts or vice versa |
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Post by irf on Jun 16, 2024 16:43:32 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? I believe so They own the BBL alongside 777 And allowed 777 to make commitments and decisions for the league And allowed 777 to choose expensive staff to make those decisions Which only works when 777 are injecting money They chose bad investors and they let those bad investors make expensive decisions They surelybhave liability for any BBL debt unless (without it being announced) 777 subsequently bought the remaining shares and took over BBL ownership entirely But I'm sure we would have heard about that? |
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Post by sporty7 on Jun 16, 2024 17:06:54 GMT
I am hopeful, well dreaming that Worcester will come back into Premier basketball in the new league. Maybe they came out of the league due to 777 involvement. Worcester have just lost premier netball, so maybe they will be interested to fill the arena with BB now. On a seperate note, I'm sure I saw Mo Walker in Worcester today
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Post by dexter on Jun 16, 2024 17:34:07 GMT
I am hopeful, well dreaming that Worcester will come back into Premier basketball in the new league. Maybe they came out of the league due to 777 involvement. Worcester have just lost premier netball, so maybe they will be interested to fill the arena with BB now. On a seperate note, I'm sure I saw Mo Walker in Worcester today I wouldn't be surprised if they do. Worcester, like Bath, really didn't want to lose their netball Superleague franchise. They chose netball over basketball, now netball has chosen Birmingham over Worcester. |
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Swish
Bench Warmer
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Post by Swish on Jun 16, 2024 18:27:41 GMT
This wasn’t in the press release from the BBF, but am I correct in thinking that 777 also own a share at least in the WBBL meaning that all the questions about the BBL and its future apply to the WBBL also?
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Post by irf on Jun 16, 2024 18:37:40 GMT
This wasn’t in the press release from the BBF, but am I correct in thinking that 777 also own a share at least in the WBBL meaning that all the questions about the BBL and its future apply to the WBBL also? Well 777 said this amongst other things before they start of last season "777 serves as the only funding partner investing millions into women’s basketball in the UK, and is proud to support a side that is now positioned as one of the most dominant teams in British sport, having recorded back-to-back domestic clean sweeps and going on an unprecedented 52-game" Not sure if funding partner means shareholder Or whether the above suggests investment into the wbl or just Lions wbl team |
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Post by baldeagle on Jun 16, 2024 22:26:16 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? I’d be amazed if they are. The clubs all hold shares in the company (Basketball League Ltd) that until last week held the licence to run the league. These shares will presumably now be worthless, but probably were before due to BLL’s debts. But the individual clubs shouldn’t be liable for BLL’s debts unless they have specifically guaranteed them, and I’d be amazed if they have done so. |
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Post by stepback3 on Jun 17, 2024 6:13:29 GMT
777s involvement in the wbbl is solwly with the lions. They have zero involvement in the running of the wbbl. The guy refused to deal with them
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Post by irf on Jun 17, 2024 7:32:06 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? I’d be amazed if they are. The clubs all hold shares in the company (Basketball League Ltd) that until last week held the licence to run the league. These shares will presumably now be worthless, but probably were before due to BLL’s debts. But the individual clubs shouldn’t be liable for BLL’s debts unless they have specifically guaranteed them, and I’d be amazed if they have done so. Yes perhaps you are right |
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Post by foxprorawks on Jun 17, 2024 7:53:04 GMT
The thing is 777 only own 45% of BBL The rest must have stayed with previous owners? Which I believe includes the clubs or some of them at least? Just because 777 created debts doesn't mean others aren't equally liable for those debts Unless I'm missing something? Here we go All the clubs own BBL alongside 777? I assume FROM WIKI "The 10 member franchises of the BBL jointly own the league[2] and a chairman is elected by the teams to oversee league operations. The head offices are located in Leicester[3] where the country's oldest team the Leicester Riders are also based." Sir Rodney Walker is still chairman isn't he? Elected by the clubs? And 777 only bought a percentage of BBL Not the entire business I think all the clubs and 777 will be liable for any unpaid debts that have been created since 777 got involved And now there's no income can come in to pay those debts? Rodney Walker resigned on 31/5. |
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Post by D44 on Jun 17, 2024 8:04:06 GMT
It was the Limited company 'The Basketball League' of which the directors were both 777 owners that was insolvent.
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Post by dexter on Jun 17, 2024 8:11:25 GMT
Are we thinking the clubs may be liable for the debts? I’d be amazed if they are. The clubs all hold shares in the company (Basketball League Ltd) that until last week held the licence to run the league. These shares will presumably now be worthless, but probably were before due to BLL’s debts. But the individual clubs shouldn’t be liable for BLL’s debts unless they have specifically guaranteed them, and I’d be amazed if they have done so. That is my understanding also, legally. In practice, if certain third parties are still owed money they might refuse to work with the BBL until those debts are paid. |
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Post by irf on Jun 17, 2024 8:11:57 GMT
It was the Limited company 'The Basketball League' of which the directors were both 777 owners that was insolvent. Interestingly the Glasgow owner shows as being a director on companies House alongside the 777 guys Appointed in March |
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Post by irf on Jun 17, 2024 8:12:14 GMT
I’d be amazed if they are. The clubs all hold shares in the company (Basketball League Ltd) that until last week held the licence to run the league. These shares will presumably now be worthless, but probably were before due to BLL’s debts. But the individual clubs shouldn’t be liable for BLL’s debts unless they have specifically guaranteed them, and I’d be amazed if they have done so. That is my understanding also, legally. In practice, if certain third parties are still owed money they might refuse to work with the BBL until those debts are paid. Yes for sure And/or refuse to work with ex BBL clubs who they link to the debts |
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Post by silverbirch on Jun 17, 2024 8:22:21 GMT
It was the Limited company 'The Basketball League' of which the directors were both 777 owners that was insolvent. Interestingly the Glasgow owner shows as being a director on companies House alongside the 777 guys Appointed in March Directors of BBL Ltd (the league operators) are 3 x 777 staff; 2 x BBL club directors (Tominay (Glads) & Knights (Flyers)) and then 3 independents which will include a chair. The clubs are shareholders, not directors, so they in theory wouldn't have oversight of the day to day of the BBL. Assume if the ship was sinking some of the directors might start resigning, especially if there are internal issues across the board. |
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Post by irf on Jun 17, 2024 8:32:23 GMT
Interestingly the Glasgow owner shows as being a director on companies House alongside the 777 guys Appointed in March Directors of BBL Ltd (the league operators) are 3 x 777 staff; 2 x BBL club directors (Tominay (Glads) & Knights (Flyers)) and then 3 independents which will include a chair. The clubs are shareholders, not directors, so they in theory wouldn't have oversight of the day to day of the BBL. Assume if the ship was sinking some of the directors might start resigning, especially if there are internal issues across the board. Kevin Routledge resigned in 2022 for example |
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Swish
Bench Warmer
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Post by Swish on Jun 17, 2024 14:49:10 GMT
777s involvement in the wbbl is solwly with the lions. They have zero involvement in the running of the wbbl. The guy refused to deal with them Thanks for the clarification |
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Post by foxprorawks on Jun 17, 2024 15:45:46 GMT
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Post by silverbirch on Jun 17, 2024 16:39:02 GMT
The plot thickens!!! The BBL board obviously were aware of what was coming down the line at least 2 weeks before the BBF action...or this was the catalyst for the BBF to get involved! |
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