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Post by irf on Dec 13, 2022 11:54:38 GMT
What's the reason for BBL clubs having to own arenas? In NBA only 7 teams own their arenas? As with most of my answers on here it will be very Eagles centric, but I'll try and answer this from our point of view up here. Our arena is way more than just a place to play a BBL game in every other Friday. It's quickly become the center of the North East basketball universe. It's rammed full every weekend with CVL (under 8s up to under 18s) games taking place, as well as academy games and local league games. Every evening there are training sessions taking place for the academy teams. These are all basketball related operations which helps create a new generation of basketball fans. The building also hosts conferences for big businesses, other sporting events and smaller meetings. All income in to the foundation. Keeping game day income isn't just a small amount of money either, in the context of the BBL. It must make a huge difference to the bottom line. From a spectator point of view it has also made it more enjoyable to go to a game as well. It's purpose built for basketball and every seat in there has a good view. Certainly a much better environment for basketball than Sports Central was. There is value in owning your own facility, but you also have to manage it correctly. As you've already alluded to I other posts, it can't sit empty when there is no BBL game on. The above is all great and works and needs applauding but doesn't bear any comparison to anything I've seen or heard lions being interested in doing themselves? |
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Post by erj14 on Dec 13, 2022 12:12:03 GMT
Yeah, I get that. It's why I'm probably in the minority, because I think 777 are going about things in the wrong way. I think it's mental to be spending the money they are on players at the moment.
I think spending money on a venue in London would've still been the way to go. I know it's a different logistical challenge in London but it could still be done and would provide great benefit to the basketball scene there. I just don't see how even being in Euroleague cam translate to being financially viable with basketball at its current level in this country.
I really hope I'm proved wrong, because if the London Lions project fails it's going be a real missed opportunity. If it succeeds, it will absolutely change the game. I just have my doubts and prefer the slow, steady, sustainable route to growing the game in the UK.
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Post by cosbyrider on Dec 13, 2022 14:18:16 GMT
What's the reason for BBL clubs having to own arenas? In NBA only 7 teams own their arenas? Food and beverages would be one of the biggest ways of bringing money in for any BBL team NBA teams, in one of the absolute biggest sports leagues in the world, with billion dollar revenue streams probably aren’t as worried about making a quid off a pint of coke in comparison It’s such a pointless comparison That’s before we mention that most NBA teams arenas were built with public funds. Bye the local authority because of the revenue they bringing over the years, again, it’s just a completely different world to the BBL and not remotely worth comparing Ironically a good number of the larger arenas in the UK are owned by local authorities. There is no comparison to be made with NBA and the BBL. It’s two differing cultures of sports - operating at different goals. The ownership of the arenas are needed to support infrastructure of womens and youth teams plus community events - as well as providing additional revenue streams. You rent Copper Box with good crowds, you can make your main event team work but you will struggle to create a legacy; you have an inability to get your entire organisation ‘under the same roof’. You also become a far more tangible asset for investment too. |
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Post by dexter on Dec 13, 2022 15:36:28 GMT
Copper Box Arena is owned and operated by Greenwich Leisure Limited . Greenwich Leisure Ltd (GLL), operating under the brand "Better", is a non-profit charitable Social Enterprise organisation which runs over 250 sport and leisure facilities and libraries on behalf of local authorities in London and across the UK.
Crystal Palace National Sports Centre is owned by the London Borough of Bromley. GLA Land and Property Limited own a 125 year lease. CPNSC is operated by GLL.
Emirates Arena is owned by Glasgow City Council. The National Basketball Performance Centre is owned by Manchester City Council.
These facilities are publicly owned because a private investor with a free reign would make more money by turning them into something else. I don’t think that is going to change in the UK. I also don’t think having basketball only arenas is viable in most cases either. They will be indoor sports arenas. That is the only way they’re going to get any public investment. Of course if Caledonia Gladiator’s owners or anyone else wants to pay for their own facility they can do what they want but I don’t see anyone else doing that.
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Post by dexter on Dec 13, 2022 18:22:29 GMT
In terms of having a home of basketball in London I believe that will be Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. There seems to be universal agreement that the facility needs to be renovated and that it needs to be the home of athletics in London. This is from the Mayor of London website:
“25 November 2022
Partial reopening of Crystal Palace National Sports Centre
A spokesperson for the Greater London Authority (GLA), said: “Centre operator Greenwich Leisure Limited has today reopened some parts of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. This includes the 25 metre pool, the gym and other areas.
“Entry and use of these facilities will be subject to temporary access arrangements until the floodlights have been removed.
“The GLA is working to remove the unsafe floodlights as quickly as possible to allow the reopening of other areas of the centre and the stadium.
“The GLA apologises for the disruption that the site closure has caused. We are completely committed to the renovation of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre and look forward to announcing a construction schedule in the early months of 2023.””
In July 2023 Athletics Diamond League returns to London. It will be at the London Stadium. There is a huge cost in converting the London Stadium back into an athletics stadium. Maybe it’ll be worth it next year, but it would be more sensible to have a permanent athletics stadium at Crystal Palace.
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Post by dexter on Dec 13, 2022 22:45:26 GMT
I’ve just watched Sam Neter’s interview with Aaron Radin. This is what I liked and I agree with. He wants to generate revenue for the league centrally. Profits will be shared equally between the BBL teams. He does not expect there to be any teams added next season. The future possible expansion teams he mentioned are a second London team, a Birmingham team, a Leeds team.
I agree with not expanding in the short term. More teams would mean diluting domestic talent and thinner slices of a tiny pie. Keeping the number of teams at ten, at a very minimum will help to keep those teams going. For example, maybe Plymouth could afford to stay at Plymouth Pavilions.
In the long term I would love to see expansion teams in London, Birmingham and Leeds.
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Post by dandayr on Dec 13, 2022 23:05:19 GMT
What's the reason for BBL clubs having to own arenas? In NBA only 7 teams own their arenas? who are the seven? |
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Post by SamH on Dec 13, 2022 23:42:42 GMT
At a guess I would say Cleveland, Utah, New Orleans, Denver, Orlando, Milwaukee and Portland?
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Post by irf on Dec 14, 2022 6:25:54 GMT
At a guess I would say Cleveland, Utah, New Orleans, Denver, Orlando, Milwaukee and Portland? Current NBA teams with their own property rights are the Nets, Wizards, Nuggets, Jazz, Trail Blazers, Pistons, and Raptors. Also Bulls own 50 per cent property rights. |
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Post by SamH on Dec 14, 2022 9:08:01 GMT
Got 3 right then, not bad!
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Post by irf on Dec 14, 2022 9:32:48 GMT
I’ve just watched Sam Neter’s interview with Aaron Radin. This is what I liked and I agree with. He wants to generate revenue for the league centrally. Profits will be shared equally between the BBL teams. He does not expect there to be any teams added next season. The future possible expansion teams he mentioned are a second London team, a Birmingham team, a Leeds team. I agree with not expanding in the short term. More teams would mean diluting domestic talent and thinner slices of a tiny pie. Keeping the number of teams at ten, at a very minimum will help to keep those teams going. For example, maybe Plymouth could afford to stay at Plymouth Pavilions. In the long term I would love to see expansion teams in London, Birmingham and Leeds. Doing a few things centrally makes sense Commercial Team getting sponsorship for the whole league and advertising etc at all the clubs Would be good A professional digital and social media manager to support and advise the clubs Maybe some league wide promotions and social media that all the clubs can get behind National advertising deals that all the league could benefit from together National hotel and travel deals There are numerous opportunities in that respect |
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Post by LTfan on Dec 15, 2022 10:41:20 GMT
In terms of having a home of basketball in London I believe that will be Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. There seems to be universal agreement that the facility needs to be renovated and that it needs to be the home of athletics in London. This is from the Mayor of London website: “25 November 2022 Partial reopening of Crystal Palace National Sports Centre A spokesperson for the Greater London Authority (GLA), said: “Centre operator Greenwich Leisure Limited has today reopened some parts of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. This includes the 25 metre pool, the gym and other areas. “Entry and use of these facilities will be subject to temporary access arrangements until the floodlights have been removed. “The GLA is working to remove the unsafe floodlights as quickly as possible to allow the reopening of other areas of the centre and the stadium. “The GLA apologises for the disruption that the site closure has caused. We are completely committed to the renovation of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre and look forward to announcing a construction schedule in the early months of 2023.”” In July 2023 Athletics Diamond League returns to London. It will be at the London Stadium. There is a huge cost in converting the London Stadium back into an athletics stadium. Maybe it’ll be worth it next year, but it would be more sensible to have a permanent athletics stadium at Crystal Palace. Regarding Crystal Palace National Sports Centre, including the athletics stadium, it really is quite depressing to see what's become of it. Once a major sporting location in London is now sad decaying shadow of its former self. The 2012 Olympics were its chance to get some major investment, but when that went to the Olympic Park on East London it was not only a lost opportunity for Crystal Palace NSC but also possibly the final nail in the coffin as events moved to the new shiny Olympic Park facilities a few miles north east. I really hope Crystal Palace NSC gets the rebirth that is often talked about. And I really hope basketball returns to it... even if it does create a bit of a personal dilemma - the Crystal Palace NSC is a lot easier for me to get to than the Copper Box, but I didn't switch alliances to City Royals a few years ago so I think I'd always stay loyal to Lions. It would make some away games very easy to get to though, easier than home games, which I know is strange. |
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Post by LTfan on Dec 15, 2022 10:43:39 GMT
I’ve just watched Sam Neter’s interview with Aaron Radin. This is what I liked and I agree with. He wants to generate revenue for the league centrally. Profits will be shared equally between the BBL teams. He does not expect there to be any teams added next season. The future possible expansion teams he mentioned are a second London team, a Birmingham team, a Leeds team. I'm particularly interested in where he thinks the second London team are coming from. |
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Post by dexter on Dec 15, 2022 11:18:32 GMT
In terms of having a home of basketball in London I believe that will be Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. There seems to be universal agreement that the facility needs to be renovated and that it needs to be the home of athletics in London. This is from the Mayor of London website: “25 November 2022 Partial reopening of Crystal Palace National Sports Centre A spokesperson for the Greater London Authority (GLA), said: “Centre operator Greenwich Leisure Limited has today reopened some parts of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre. This includes the 25 metre pool, the gym and other areas. “Entry and use of these facilities will be subject to temporary access arrangements until the floodlights have been removed. “The GLA is working to remove the unsafe floodlights as quickly as possible to allow the reopening of other areas of the centre and the stadium. “The GLA apologises for the disruption that the site closure has caused. We are completely committed to the renovation of the Crystal Palace National Sports Centre and look forward to announcing a construction schedule in the early months of 2023.”” In July 2023 Athletics Diamond League returns to London. It will be at the London Stadium. There is a huge cost in converting the London Stadium back into an athletics stadium. Maybe it’ll be worth it next year, but it would be more sensible to have a permanent athletics stadium at Crystal Palace. Regarding Crystal Palace National Sports Centre, including the athletics stadium, it really is quite depressing to see what's become of it. Once a major sporting location in London is now sad decaying shadow of its former self. The 2012 Olympics were its chance to get some major investment, but when that went to the Olympic Park on East London it was not only a lost opportunity for Crystal Palace NSC but also possibly the final nail in the coffin as events moved to the new shiny Olympic Park facilities a few miles north east. I really hope Crystal Palace NSC gets the rebirth that is often talked about. And I really hope basketball returns to it... even if it does create a bit of a personal dilemma - the Crystal Palace NSC is a lot easier for me to get to than the Copper Box, but I didn't switch alliances to City Royals a few years ago so I think I'd always stay loyal to Lions. It would make some away games very easy to get to though, easier than home games, which I know is strange. I believe the facilities should be used together. MLB London Series needs a big stadium. We will see how full the London Stadium is for the Diamond League London event this summer. It could be an annual Diamond League event is better suited to a renovated Crystal Palace NSC. In basketball London Lions need a big arena like the Copper Box. It’s also used for England netball team and London Pulse. But as a place for age grade tournaments and even for the ladies’ team a smaller venue such as the indoor arena at CPNSC is suitable. But it has to be nice. And then there are minor British sports like American football Britbowl, Great Britain American football national team, handball, volleyball, indoor hockey. They don’t need the London Stadium or the Copper Box Arena to play their finals and international games in, but they need somewhere nice. |
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Post by lochrocks on Dec 22, 2022 16:42:26 GMT
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Post by ScottishBasketballFan on Dec 29, 2022 9:06:43 GMT
Is this article covering stuff from the podcast? www.heraldscotland.com/sport/23217207.new-bbl-boss-aaron-radin-aiming-shoot-stars/I like how he mentions wanting a rival for the current and only Scottish team in the league, I feel it could happen but needs a big plan. Dundee getting a mention is positive, I've been to the DIA, good wee venue, not sure how they'd be able to fit the Stars and a basketball team in there. Belfast was mentioned as well, that would be great, but it has to make financial sense. I see also in the article it said about previous investment in the league, what makes them think things will be different this time around? |
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Post by dexter on Dec 29, 2022 11:08:59 GMT
Is this article covering stuff from the podcast? www.heraldscotland.com/sport/23217207.new-bbl-boss-aaron-radin-aiming-shoot-stars/I like how he mentions wanting a rival for the current and only Scottish team in the league, I feel it could happen but needs a big plan. Dundee getting a mention is positive, I've been to the DIA, good wee venue, not sure how they'd be able to fit the Stars and a basketball team in there. Belfast was mentioned as well, that would be great, but it has to make financial sense. I see also in the article it said about previous investment in the league, what makes them think things will be different this time around? Yes it is. I recognise what he said about not wanting new franchises to cannibalise existing franchises. I don't think there's much risk of that unless the second franchise was in or around Glasgow. My concern with Dundee is it would be competing with the Stars for fans and local media coverage. Edinburgh or Aberdeen are the obvious choices. Aberdeen doesn't have many professional sports teams, and Edinburgh has quite a few options for a venue. |
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Post by stepback3 on Dec 30, 2022 15:11:58 GMT
What realistic options does Edinburgh have? The city lacks good sporting space.
Aberdeens new arena is amazing. Would be a project to fill that place but is an impressive set up.
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Post by dexter on Dec 30, 2022 15:32:55 GMT
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Post by dexter on Dec 30, 2022 15:51:54 GMT
What realistic options does Edinburgh have? The city lacks good sporting space. Aberdeens new arena is amazing. Would be a project to fill that place but is an impressive set up. I just looked up the Aberdeen Arena (P&J Live). It is amazing. They should host the BBL Trophy final. |
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