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Post by stepback3 on Feb 29, 2024 18:29:10 GMT
Big difference between 777 ran club and bbl ran clubs.
The rumours of a major reduction to the womens budget for next season and europe a no no is the start of the foundations washing away
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Post by LTfan on Feb 29, 2024 18:35:00 GMT
Big difference between 777 ran club and bbl ran clubs. The rumours of a major reduction to the womens budget for next season and europe a no no is the start of the foundations washing away Dramatically reducing the London Lions Women’s budget for next season makes a change from the perhaps reckless spending of cash in the London Lions organisation. Cutting costs in the areas of least profit and potential is perhaps the most sensible thing they’ve done in a long time (and I hate saying that given how well London Lions Women are doing in Europe - they honestly could win the EuroCup!). But is it too little too late? |
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Post by SamH on Feb 29, 2024 18:46:19 GMT
And what about Manchester and Plymouth? They might find buyers too or be included in a deal? Reminds me of when Worthing Bears were going to the wall - in come 2 big American investors only to pull out a few months later (one turned out to be dodgy) rescued by Christian Hamilton, who I think was a local business man, but run on a shoestring for a season and a half before the move to Brighton became workable. Around the same time investment was secured from Romek Kriwald, who I think owned Pets at Home and was pretty minted. He then brought Nick Nurse in and the turnaround was complete. Until he left and Nick f**ked it all up.
The point is there are people out there who want to invest and get involved. Kriwald also used to play locally for a team I practiced with a few times, so he was a baller as well as a businessman. There must be others like him around.
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Post by dexter on Feb 29, 2024 19:19:28 GMT
This is what I think will happen. Lions and Patriots will cease to exist. Giants will be saved or maybe replaced with a different name. There will be a BBL next season, with 8 teams, but possibly called something else. I'm quite hopeful for most teams this will be a set back not a disaster.
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Post by LTfan on Feb 29, 2024 19:27:16 GMT
And what about Manchester and Plymouth? They might find buyers too or be included in a deal? Reminds me of when Worthing Bears were going to the wall - in come 2 big American investors only to pull out a few months later (one turned out to be dodgy) rescued by Christian Hamilton, who I think was a local business man, but run on a shoestring for a season and a half before the move to Brighton became workable. Around the same time investment was secured from Romek Kriwald, who I think owned Pets at Home and was pretty minted. He then brought Nick Nurse in and the turnaround was complete. Until he left and Nick f**ked it all up. The point is there are people out there who want to invest and get involved. Kriwald also used to play locally for a team I practiced with a few times, so he was a baller as well as a businessman. There must be others like him around. I said London because they’re a ready-made complete package, whereas Manchester and Plymouth still require some work. If you’re interested in investing in british basketball and you’ve got the opportunity to buy the London Lions off an administrator, it feels like a no-brainier. Having said that, you’d have to do a full review of their business model or you’ll find yourself in the same position as the previous owners. I also said London because I really want the team that got me back into british basketball 14 years ago to still be around next season. |
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Post by blueskies99 on Feb 29, 2024 19:30:54 GMT
This is what I think will happen. Lions and Patriots will cease to exist. Giants will be saved or maybe replaced with a different name. There will be a BBL next season, with 8 teams, but possibly called something else. I'm quite hopeful for most teams this will be a set back not a disaster. What about the remainder of this season? |
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Post by dexter on Feb 29, 2024 19:37:20 GMT
This is what I think will happen. Lions and Patriots will cease to exist. Giants will be saved or maybe replaced with a different name. There will be a BBL next season, with 8 teams, but possibly called something else. I'm quite hopeful for most teams this will be a set back not a disaster. What about the remainder of this season? I'm just hoping this can be dragged out until the end of the season. It will be a real shame if it can't. |
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Post by spacejammer on Feb 29, 2024 20:37:57 GMT
Top level basketball will survive in some guise no doubt. As will the non-777 backed clubs. It'll just be massively stripped back. I now can't help but feel the end is nigh-er than I thought though. Maybe I’m delusional, but in an administration scenario I could see both the BBL and London Lions surviving, maybe. Assigned administrators would first attempt to find buyers for the league, and maybe someone out there might see potential in acquiring the league at a knocked down price. Same for London Lions, they could even be packaged together. Something with potential has certainly been built in London so a ready made basketball team in London with a decent following and reputation might be appealing to the right buyer. But even in this best case scenario I fully accept neither the league or the London Lions would continue to operate at the level we’ve seen this season. I agree with Bigz the teams outside of the 777 bubble will survive but for the Lions and the other 2 teams I would worry. The only the league will be better is if 777 walked away and somehow despite the wreckage someone else or another group are interested enough to pick up the pieces. Again with the league being televised stateside will this has attracted anyone new or a big buyer to take interest? If not then despite the survival of the other teams then I can see the league going backwards. I think with the reintroduction of the salary cap. Despite everyone calling for it to be reinstated if 777 was to go I would be tempted to say they don't need to rush to reintroduce it. As let's be honest if no one else has the big wade of cash that London has then surely the league shouldn't become as unbalanced. And even if someone came with the big money after this ships gone down hopefully the league might also be a little wiser before letting someone untrustworthy take over. |
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Post by mac on Mar 1, 2024 0:59:15 GMT
So if 777 Partners collapse and the BBL are put into administration, what happens to any debt or contracts signed like the streaming deal? Are the other nine clubs responsible for their share as 6.111% shareholders or could they be on the hook for it all?
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Post by SamH on Mar 1, 2024 1:04:40 GMT
I think if they are shareholders then they're not responsible for debts - if anything they'd be on the list of creditors, should they be owed any payments from the BBL entity. The other 7 clubs are not part of the BBL the organisation/company, hence why they'd be left as stand alone franchises just without a league to play in if the BBL disappeared. Which I am sure would lead to a quick formation of a new league, presumably owned equally between the 7 teams until additional investment can be secured in it.
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Post by donthatetheplayer on Mar 1, 2024 11:32:17 GMT
The sheer amount of debt that 777 have dumped on the British Basketball League Ltd will ensure it couldn't go on. Here's a list of current directors; find-and-update.company-information.service.gov.uk/company/01998309/officers1 charge was placed on the Ltd Co in Jan 24 - probably something to do with the rumoured £3m or so to keep it afloat. So if the money is running out, the BBL will be toast - anyone buying it will have to pump in millions to wipe the slate - ain't happening. The old BBL while never particularly profitable, wiped its face. One can argue that 777 while creating a media company first and nothing resembling a sustainable business second, third etc, leave alone a successful basketball league, they have failed spectacularly on just about every count. Give me the old days before covid when you had 3-4 teams capable of winning the league, battling it on the crappy BBL Player with shonky titles. What we have now is window dressing, owners mired deep in multiple federal charges and enough smoke and mirrors to impress Harry Houdini. At this moment, I'd take the old BBL back in a heartbeat - oh and the trophy, come to think of it, we'd like that back too. |
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Post by dandayr on Mar 1, 2024 12:52:03 GMT
as i recall, the company british basketball league runs the pro league under a fixed duration licence agreement - believe that was originally issued through basketballengland though with BBF taking on a bigger role in recent years in player licence international transfers its not clear what role BBF has on licencing league - if any or none
uninformed assumption being if the worst was to happen and the company BBL who runs the top league was to fold then the licence would expire and not just be passed to anyone who tried to buy it from the administrator? So any new league would need to go through an approval process with BE an/or BBF to be licenced to run the pro league in GB.
I'm sure someone who spends more time and thought on this can clarify how much of that is accurate and how much is my misunderstanding of the role of the three parties BE, BBF, BBL.
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Post by cosbyrider on Mar 1, 2024 13:17:26 GMT
You have to remember there’s already been a lot of play behind the scenes. The situation was flagged to government. Fully expect the other shareholders have been talking - it was rumoured not all of them wanted the recent cash injection
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Post by eillo23 on Mar 3, 2024 18:42:41 GMT
I feel the outcome of this is dependent on the Everton takeover.
I have a feeling they will get approved, but could be wrong. But if they do then the BBL and London won’t be going anywhere. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them offload a couple of the other football clubs but not the bbl or London. They will need to keep both going for their image in the U.K. Also British Basketball has huge potential. If they can attract investment/sponsorship then can see great things ahead.
Alternatively, they don’t get approval at Everton and things may not go as well.
Have been looking into them a lot recently and reading non-bias articles from both sides. Looking at accounts of businesses they own, and they actually have made some big money in insurance in their own right, especially Steven Pasko. There is always a lot of talk about Wander, but Pasko seems to go under the radar a little.
Pasko was at the Lions game today which was great to see.
Hopefully the Everton situation can get sorted asap, and we get some good news coming out over the next couple of months for the plans ahead and with Plymouth and Manchester.
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Post by spacejammer on Mar 4, 2024 10:35:04 GMT
I feel the outcome of this is dependent on the Everton takeover. I have a feeling they will get approved, but could be wrong. But if they do then the BBL and London won’t be going anywhere. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them offload a couple of the other football clubs but not the bbl or London. They will need to keep both going for their image in the U.K. Also British Basketball has huge potential. If they can attract investment/sponsorship then can see great things ahead. Alternatively, they don’t get approval at Everton and things may not go as well. Have been looking into them a lot recently and reading non-bias articles from both sides. Looking at accounts of businesses they own, and they actually have made some big money in insurance in their own right, especially Steven Pasko. There is always a lot of talk about Wander, but Pasko seems to go under the radar a little. Pasko was at the Lions game today which was great to see. Hopefully the Everton situation can get sorted asap, and we get some good news coming out over the next couple of months for the plans ahead and with Plymouth and Manchester. If they don't get approved for Everton and the tap is turned off. I wonder how long until we start seeing the Lions crisis appeal come out. "Please by donating just £5 a month will help keep these majestic Lions thriving in their natural habitat at the Olympic Park in London. If not they will may go extinct very soon. If you have a heart please text save LIONS to the number 777 and help us pay the bill. " |
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Post by ScottishBasketballFan on Mar 4, 2024 10:57:48 GMT
I remember in ice hockey, Coventry Blaze had the begging bowls out, they had success in the season just before the Clan joined then many years later they struggled, fans gave them money but then used it to sign more players.
This is why I'll never give money to another team
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Post by dexter on Mar 4, 2024 11:58:04 GMT
This reminds me of Wasps in rugby. They had big fanciful plans and ambitions. They bought a stadium nowhere near their fan base. And when they inevitably ran out of cash they paid their debt payments by selling bonds to their fans. Those fans lost their bonds when the club was liquidated. Now they shamelessly want to do it all again in Sevenoaks.
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Post by SamH on Mar 4, 2024 12:33:34 GMT
Similar to the Brighton Bears - Nick Nurse sold season tickets and he sold a 3 year major sponsorship deal, which only got 1 season out of it (hopefully they didn't pay for 3 years up front though). With the whole thing going tits up he then sodded off back to the States and that was that. I don't think anyone who'd bought a season ticket got their money back, although by the time the 05/06 season finished I think most people knew there were problems anyway. I remember thinking at the last home game that this is probably the final game, and there was a dad and son there who'd really enjoyed their "first game" and were looking forward to next season - I remember thinking then, that was pretty unfortunate. So we must have known it was coming to an end, but I think some folk did still buy season tickets. There was also a lot of hoo-har over a TV someone won by hitting a half court shot, and they never got the TV. Even further back, Worthing Thunder did some begging but fair play to them - you actually got something back. All the players offered various services to the highest bidder - coaching or whatever. That raised quite a bit of money I think. I bid for and won Turkish lessons from one of the players as I was keen on a Turkish girl at the time  |
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Post by LTfan on Mar 4, 2024 13:50:46 GMT
I feel the outcome of this is dependent on the Everton takeover. I have a feeling they will get approved, but could be wrong. But if they do then the BBL and London won’t be going anywhere. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them offload a couple of the other football clubs but not the bbl or London. They will need to keep both going for their image in the U.K. Also British Basketball has huge potential. If they can attract investment/sponsorship then can see great things ahead. Alternatively, they don’t get approval at Everton and things may not go as well. Have been looking into them a lot recently and reading non-bias articles from both sides. Looking at accounts of businesses they own, and they actually have made some big money in insurance in their own right, especially Steven Pasko. There is always a lot of talk about Wander, but Pasko seems to go under the radar a little. Pasko was at the Lions game today which was great to see. Hopefully the Everton situation can get sorted asap, and we get some good news coming out over the next couple of months for the plans ahead and with Plymouth and Manchester. I totally agree with this, and have been saying so for a while, I think the potential Everton acquisition is pivotal to both the London Lions and the BBL - or at least 777 Partners continued interest. If 777 Partners own Everton (or have a shot at owning Everton) I can't see them letting the London Lions or the BBL collapse, even if for no other reason than they don't want the bad publicity (lets be honest, the London Lions and the BBL are costing them peanuts comparted to what Everton are/will). Sort of unrelated, but I've seen Wander courtside at at least one London game. Good to hear Pasko has been in attendance too. |
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Post by dexter on Mar 4, 2024 14:26:40 GMT
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