Arenas

[isthaturinal]

Jan 31, 2024 19:41:11 GMT eillo23 said:

Jan 31, 2024 19:19:12 GMT isthaturinal said:

I can’t bloody find it now 
It was on one of the many basketball profiles on IG that I follow.
The hunt continues.

I did see that post to but can’t find it now. The pavilions has always been a joke for cost by the sound of it.

Thank god for that….thought I was going mad.

Or are we both LOL

[dexter]

Jan 31, 2024 20:50:58 GMT isthaturinal said:

Jan 31, 2024 19:41:11 GMT eillo23 said:

I did see that post to but can’t find it now. The pavilions has always been a joke for cost by the sound of it.

Thank god for that….thought I was going mad.

Or are we both LOL

I imagine the reason for the high cost is theatre tickets are usually more expensive than BBL tickets, plus the court takes up half the theatre.
But how are they going to come up with a new venue? Who's going to pay for it?

[voise]

Jan 31, 2024 19:41:11 GMT eillo23 said:

Jan 31, 2024 19:19:12 GMT isthaturinal said:

I can’t bloody find it now 
It was on one of the many basketball profiles on IG that I follow.
The hunt continues.

I did see that post to but can’t find it now. The pavilions has always been a joke for cost by the sound of it.

The Hoopers Voice posted it

[dexter]

A new arena coming to West London

www.fulhamsw6.com/#!pages/shared:common:hfnewarea001

Now I'm not suggesting this will host basketball, but it would be the main music and entertainment venue in West London. In my opinion Wembley Arena should be more of a sports venue and home to a BBL team. London Patriots? London Towers?

[dexter]

Sorry that link didn't work. This is from the Telegraph.


‘Nobody needs to give me a pep talk about the UK – I’m spending £365m here’
Interview: O2 Arena mastermind Tim Leiweke on building a rival London stadium

Daniel Woolfson
20 April 2024 • 12:00pm

54
Tim Leiweke the boss of Oak view Group who built Co-op Live
Tim Leiweke, the American businessman who has just spent £365m on building the new Co-op Live arena in Manchester, is in talks to open a second arena near Hammersmith.

Mr Leiweke spent almost 20 years at Anschutz Entertainment Group (AEG) and has been described as the main architect of the O2’s success and a pivotal figure in transforming it from its previous incarnation as the Millennium Dome.

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AEG is presided over by the notoriously secretive American billionaire Philip Anschutz, who made his fortune in the oil industry. It owns hundreds of venues across the world.

“Phil and I had almost a 20-year run, so no matter how he feels about us, I have nothing but good things to say about them,” says Leiweke.

He left AEG in 2013 to lead the Canadian sports giant Maple Leaf, then set up his own development company, Oak View Group, in 2015. He told the Telegraph he believed AEG had become complacent, as he seeks to expand in the capital.

“[The fact we worked together] doesn’t mean I’m not going to take advantage of their shortness, their brain freeze or their level of comfort – and I think they got comfortable.”

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The two parties have already clashed over the development of Co-op Live in Manchester, which opens next week, when comedian Peter Kay will take the stage for the venue’s first show. Over the coming months the likes of Pearl Jam, Olivia Rodrigo, Slipknot and Nicki Minaj will perform on its stage.

The huge arena, which counts Harry Styles as a major investor, was built in partnership with City Football Group, the Abu Dhabi-backed owner of Manchester City, and sits adjacent to the club’s Etihad stadium on a vast so-called “campus” east of the city.

Co-op LIVE, Manchester
Peter Kay will perform Co-op Live's first show when it opens next week
Leiweke’s bet with Co-op Live is that it will tap into growing appeal for what has been dubbed “multi-purpose” venues that combine sports, eating out and other forms of entertainment, which have soared since the end of the pandemic.

“We were fortunate that the bet we made – that we’d see the single greatest live entertainment return and surge in the history of the industry – is what we’ve seen these past few years,” he says.

It comes as Emirati investment is coming under increasing scrutiny, after the UAE-backed bid to buy The Telegraph was effectively blocked by the Government amid fears over the impact of a foreign state owning major media assets.

Crucially though, Co-op Live is just two miles from Manchester’s AO Arena, which until recently was part of a company part-owned by AEG. Throughout the development process, that company – called ASM Global – raised repeated objections to Leiweke’s plans. ASM was sold in November 2023 and is no longer linked to AEG.

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Leiweke says he’s not worried about competition with the other arena. “I used to marvel because I’d walk through that arena and think, ‘oh my god, this is just an absolutely terrible place to come to listen to a concert’.

“It was built for the Commonwealth Games, it was never built for music… the acoustics aren’t great, the customer service isn’t great,” he says, pointing out that when what is now the AO Arena was constructed in the 1990s, much of its funding came from government grants.

“We invested the largest single sum of money ever spent on an arena outside of the US in the history of the industry.

“When you want to be an entrepreneur and to make an investment in Manchester, in Britain, come have this fight with me. And then we’ll have an equal fight.”

O2 Arena
The former Millennium Dome was reopened as the O2 Arena in 2007 CREDIT: Ian West/PA Archive
A spokesman for the AO Arena says it has spent £50m recently on “artist and fan experiences”.

“Our venue is legendary and has delighted millions of fans for over 30 years. Being a great venue isn’t something you can promise to be, you have to deliver and we have been delivering goosebump experiences for generations of fans for decades.”

Plans to build a massive venue in west London would put Leiweke in direct competition with his former boss Anschutz again. Leiweke expects the project to take about a year “before it gets real” but says early conversations with authorities had been positive.

Asked where exactly it will be, he says: “If you guessed Hammersmith it would be a good guess.

“We’re pretty focused on a particular site. We’re excited about the site. But I understand there’s a process and we need to talk to neighbours, we need to talk to the community, we need to talk to the business leaders and to political leaders. We’re going to play by their rules, I’m not going to get ahead of them.”

Yet other developers have struggled to get large-scale projects built in the capital recently.

MSG Group, the owner of Madison Square Garden in New York, abandoned plans to build a huge “Sphere” venue in East London after six years of planning troubles.

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MSG claimed the venue had become “a political football between rival political parties”. Sadiq Khan and Michael Gove, the levelling up secretary, had clashed over the scheme.

The embittered company said it would instead seek out “forward-thinking cities around the world that are serious about bringing this next-generation entertainment experience to their communities”.

The MSG (Madison Square Garden) Sphere, a music entertainment arena, is lit up with basketballs to celebrate the 2023 NBA Summer League in Las Vegas, Nevada
Plans for an east London version of Las Vegas' Maddison Square Garden Sphere were abandoned amid planning issues CREDIT: Patrick T Fallon/AFP
“It’s a lost opportunity for all,” says Leiweke. “I feel bad for Jim [Dolan, MSG Group’s chief executive], he put a lot of money into that project. I also think the Sphere is literally one of the marvels and wonders of society today.”

However, many see the collapse of the Sphere project as emblematic of wider concerns that an excess of red tape and planning delays are making it harder to get things built in London.

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Plans to redevelop Earl’s Court have repeatedly been scaled back over a planning process plagued by delays and objections, while Marks & Spencer spent much of the last year embroiled in a row with Michael Gove over plans to redevelop its Marble Arch store.

Leiweke dismisses suggestions that he may run into trouble in the capital. “I am not deferred in this mission statement, I am not altered in my enthusiasm for the opportunity,” he says.

“No disrespect to New York or Los Angeles, but London is the best market in the world, especially for live entertainment. London deserves to have the greatest arena in the world. They don’t yet.”

He is similarly upbeat on the UK’s appeal for overseas investors, despite gloomy official forecasts predicting a 5pc contraction in business investment this year.

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“I don’t think anyone needs to come to me and give me a pep talk about the UK. You probably kick yourself more than you should,” he says.

“If I had concerns, questions or even recommendations, I guess we wouldn’t be spending £365m now, would we?”

For now, all eyes will be on the opening of Co-op Live in Manchester and whether the Northern city really does have space for two major stadiums.

But as plans are put in place to expand in the capital, the stage is being set for another showdown.

[dexter]

This part I found interesting

"Leiweke says he’s not worried about competition with the other arena. “I used to marvel because I’d walk through that arena and think, ‘oh my god, this is just an absolutely terrible place to come to listen to a concert’.

“It was built for the Commonwealth Games, it was never built for music… the acoustics aren’t great, the customer service isn’t great,” he says, pointing out that when what is now the AO Arena was constructed in the 1990s, much of its funding came from government grants."

The AO Arena, like the Wembley Arena, was built as a sports arena. I welcome the building of these new music and entertainment arenas because they will help to free up the likes of the AO Arena and the Wembley Arena to host sports events. If Manchester Giants become a bigger better team they should play some big games at the AO Arena. Home derbies against Cheshire. Play off games when the new play off format gets more established.

[dexter]

The Netball Superleague is going professional from 2025; called NSL 2.0. I'm posting this here because it is very relevant to the indoor sports arenas available in Britain. There will be 8 teams. 4 current teams have been dropped, there are 2 new teams, and one team will be moved and under new ownership.

Dropped from NSL

Strathclyde Sirens. Home arena Emirates Arena sports hall. Not in the 2025 NSL because they can't afford the increase in budget. This leaves Emirates Arena without a home team.

Severn Stars. Home arena University of Worcester Arena. Dropped because they don't have a big enough arena. This means Worcester has now lost its BBL team, rugby team, women's rugby team, and netball superleague team.

Team Bath Netball. Home arena University of Bath Arena. Dropped because the arena is too small. This leaves the South West without a NSL because there are no large indoor arenas in the region.

Surrey Storm. Home Arena Surrey Sports Park Arena. Dropped because there isn't a big enough arena available.

New teams

Birmingham Panthers. The home arena hasn't been announced yet, but it's going to be either Birmingham Arena (NIA) or NEC Arena.

Nottingham Forest Netball. Nottingham Forest FC owner Evangelos Marinakis loves multi sport clubs. His Greek club Olympiacos has a basketball team in Euroleague. Could he be tempted to launch a BBL team? Nottingham Forest Netball's home arena will be the Nottingham Motorpoint Arena, which is also home of Nottingham Panthers.

Team under new ownership

Saracens Mavericks will become London Mavericks under new ownership. Their home arena has not been announced but I think it's probably going to be Wembley Arena.

5 existing teams to play in NSL 2.0
Cardiff Dragons, home arena not announced.
Leeds Rhinos, home arena not announced but likely to be the First Direct Arena.
Manchester Thunder, home arena not announced but likely to be the AO Arena.
London Pulse. Home Arena is the Copper Box Arena.
Loughborough Lightening. Home Arena is currently the Sir David Wallace Arena at Loughborough University. It hasn't been announced what arena they will use in 2025. Leicestershire probably needs a new arena.

[irf]

Forest have launched a netball team

That's pretty big news

Having the backing and support that comes with a Premier League football club gives them a huge opportunity

And playing in the Motorpoint arena allows for crowds of 9k ish

More than half of which will be football fans of Forest getting behind a new team and sport

Netball is really hitting the big time at the moment

[dexter]

May 30, 2024 21:43:06 GMT irf said:

Forest have launched a netball team

That's pretty big news

Having the backing and support that comes with a Premier League football club gives them a huge opportunity

And playing in the Motorpoint arena allows for crowds of 9k ish

More than half of which will be football fans of Forest getting behind a new team and sport

Netball is really hitting the big time at the moment

Yes well we will see if it's a success, but I think it stands a good chance. Only 8 teams. Probably an opening weekend in central location, so only 7 home games to sell. They're going to try to share the talent evenly between the teams so games will be competitive.

I think probably Birmingham Panthers will play their home games in Utilita Arena Birmingham (NIA), and Loughborough Lightening will play their games in Resorts World Arena (NEC) because that's only 45 minutes from Loughborough.

Leeds Rhinos will probably split their games between First Direct Arena in Leeds and Utilita Arena Sheffield because they cover the whole of Yorkshire.

Cardiff Dragons will probably play at Utilita Arena Cardiff.

They are primarily basing their teams at the biggest indoor arenas in the biggest cities in England and Wales, which is what the BBL talked about but never did.

[eagles18000]

apples and oranges

7 home games over a few months as opposed to 20
plus over a whole season.

I know what i prefer

[dexter]

May 30, 2024 22:39:12 GMT eagles18000 said:

apples and oranges

7 home games over a few months as opposed to 20
plus over a whole season.

I know what i prefer

Yes 7 home games is more like a tournament than a league. I don't know if it's a good idea or not. Sad times for the fans of the 4 teams that have been dropped.

[stepback3]

The arena costs for these venues is going to be insane. It feels a bit sink or swim from netball. Is their demand for 9k at a netball game if all need to pay a substantial gate. They must have a considerable investment coming in. I think the bbl will be watching closely

[stepback3]

The arena costs for these venues is going to be insane. It feels a bit sink or swim from netball. Is their demand for 9k at a netball game if all need to pay a substantial gate. They must have a considerable investment coming in. I think the bbl will be watching closely

[skeg]

I think part of NSL’s statement was to have at least 50% of games in arenas so that leaves a bit of wiggle room venue wise.

[dexter]

May 31, 2024 9:17:04 GMT skeg said:

I think part of NSL’s statement was to have at least 50% of games in arenas so that leaves a bit of wiggle room venue wise.

Yes, and as the season will probably start with a big weekend event at one venue, that means teams only have to sell 3 or 4 home games at a big venue.
They have chosen teams and venues that are quite close together so they're probably hoping to get some fans travelling to away games.

I also read that Birmingham Panthers will play some home games in Worcester, so whilst Worcester has lost its team they're not totally excluded from the NSL, unlike Bath, Surrey and Scotland.

[naenia]

Have to wonder what the Storm losing their place in NSL will mean for Surrey Sports Park - and the Scorchers in turn.

[dexter]

May 31, 2024 13:29:45 GMT naenia said:

Have to wonder what the Storm losing their place in NSL will mean for Surrey Sports Park - and the Scorchers in turn.

As England Netball don't want them they should replace Surrey Storm with a WBBL team.

[cosbyrider]

Some risk there.

I know they did a cracking job with crowds for the World Cup at the Echo Arena but it’s gonna be a real effort to be break even with the rent

[irf]

Can't speak for the other teams but I would put money on Forest selling out their arena for their games

Could actually become a hot ticket

Good family day out and affordable

And a big fanbase to inherit

There are 6,000 on a waiting list for season tickets for the football

I imagine the next step will be Forest season tickets that include both sports

The Forest owner own Olympiakos so very used to opening multiple sports teams

The Birmingham team maybe links up with Villa at some stage

[spacejammer]

May 31, 2024 18:18:52 GMT irf said:

Can't speak for the other teams but I would put money on Forest selling out their arena for their games

Could actually become a hot ticket

Good family day out and affordable

And a big fanbase to inherit

There are 6,000 on a waiting list for season tickets for the football

I imagine the next step will be Forest season tickets that include both sports

The Forest owner own Olympiakos so very used to opening multiple sports teams

The Birmingham team maybe links up with Villa at some stage

It is an interesting concept indeed to see Netball do the football alliance but not basketball.
Considering teams like Real Madrid and Bayern Munich etc... in the Euroleague do this?

I suppose the main reason for this is because from a football team perspective especially a major Premier or Championship team theirs probably very little in it for them is why it has not happened.

Using London as an example if Westham were to suddenly take them over they become the Hammers basketball FC would that suddenly raise their profile and the leagues profile?

Equally if a big Premier league team with a British Basketball team was to invest in a netball team but not a BBL club.
Then it would have to make me question what attracted them more towards Netball?