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Post by sonjel on Jan 28, 2022 11:11:51 GMT
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Post by sonjel on Jan 28, 2022 11:17:34 GMT
Sorry for the duplication chaps. Just seen this mentioned on the Project Rebound thread. Still......gets my post count up!
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Post by SamH on Jan 28, 2022 16:48:49 GMT
Birmingham is such an obvious city to have a BBL club, you'd think it would be a team that would draw big support and could play in a decent arena like the NIA or NEC, its always baffled me why it hasn't been a doddle to sustain a team there. There must be a huge market for basketball there just based on the population size!
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Solly
Sixth Man
NBL Wolves on Tour 2021
Posts: 104 
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Post by Solly on Jan 28, 2022 17:38:36 GMT
I'll believe all this when I see it.
Coventry Bears Rugby League also hope to get some sort of legacy from the (ridiculous waste of my council tax) Commonwealth Games, having recently rebranded as Midlands Hurricanes. That is also pie in the sky.
Any Birmingham basketball fans may as well prep themselves for a visit to the pit that is Chelmsley Wood Sports Centre - that's where every previous Birmingham (BBL) incarnation has ended up - and Chelmsley Wood is not even in Birmingham!
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Post by milehigh on Jan 29, 2022 9:27:03 GMT
Fortunately the current group have a lot more ability and integrity than the last few owners of Birmingham based teams.
Remember Bob Hope was involved at the very beginning of what eventually became Birmingham Bullets, when they were known as Granwood and played at Warwick Uni.
The COB Rockets invested heavily in their current venue, which is better than some BBL venues right now, and would allow a side to develop a following before moving to Arena Birmingham. Ideally there would be a mid sized venue, like the old AVLS which had a c4000 capacity.
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Post by bullets92 on Jan 29, 2022 10:09:23 GMT
Fortunately the current group have a lot more ability and integrity than the last few owners of Birmingham based teams. Remember Bob Hope was involved at the very beginning of what eventually became Birmingham Bullets, when they were known as Granwood and played at Warwick Uni. The COB Rockets invested heavily in their current venue, which is better than some BBL venues right now, and would allow a side to develop a following before moving to Arena Birmingham. Ideally there would be a mid sized venue, like the old AVLS which had a c4000 capacity. Unfortunately that has been the issue here for some time here...the lack of those mid sized venues. Yes the COB venue is fantastic but even with a possible expansion (think they're waiting on council approval) it's still less than a capacity of several hundred. The larger venues have always charged over the odds. Hopefully this potential investment would fund that |
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Post by spacejammer on Jan 29, 2022 19:03:00 GMT
Birmingham is such an obvious city to have a BBL club, you'd think it would be a team that would draw big support and could play in a decent arena like the NIA or NEC, its always baffled me why it hasn't been a doddle to sustain a team there. There must be a huge market for basketball there just based on the population size! But it's as someone said on the old board just because a team is in a major city doesn't mean its got a better chance or more sustainable then a team from a small town. When you look at Birmingham, Leeds and Liverpool you'd think a franchise would be able to thrive there yet have ended up going extinct. Even the London City Royals in London which given the size you'd think could make 2 clubs work crumbled. If you pulled up a map of the UK their are loads of areas without where you could stick a BBL franchise. The question is finding which places would work? |
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Post by SamH on Jan 29, 2022 22:28:15 GMT
True, but Birmingham is bigger than all of those cities and it's highly diverse. The sport has a higher participation rate among BAME ethnicities than some of the more popular sports in the UK, so I would have thought a very diverse city like Birmingham would thus have a potentially larger market to operate in. I'm sure the Bullets had a good following back in the day?
As for why some cities seem to do better than others or have more supportive markets, hard to say. Some of it no doubt comes down to the ability of the teams management to market the product and establish itself in the community. Winning can help too, lots of fair weather fans out there.
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Post by bullets92 on Jan 30, 2022 16:24:10 GMT
True, but Birmingham is bigger than all of those cities and it's highly diverse. The sport has a higher participation rate among BAME ethnicities than some of the more popular sports in the UK, so I would have thought a very diverse city like Birmingham would thus have a potentially larger market to operate in. I'm sure the Bullets had a good following back in the day? As for why some cities seem to do better than others or have more supportive markets, hard to say. Some of it no doubt comes down to the ability of the teams management to market the product and establish itself in the community. Winning can help too, lots of fair weather fans out there. Today's attendance shows the hunger for basketball here. Not saying we'd get 10,000 every week...but if you take the Giants and riders fans out today...there's still a good 7000+ people here Like you say just needs to be marketed right with a decent enough product |
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Post by milehigh on Jan 31, 2022 8:33:13 GMT
There is a lot of work to do, but this time there ae good, honest professional people involved.
The choice of venue is a key factor. Basing the club in Chelmsley Wood or the NEC would be a bad move, the club needs to be in a more central venue, even if it's a curtained off section of the NIA. with the court running at right angles to the layout used for the BBL Cup final. The venue has, or had, the capability to significantly reduce the area used to provide a more intimate arena for concert.
A regular game night at the NIA which has great transport links, good, but overpriced parking, and a choice of entertainment venues to eat, drink and socialise before and/or after games would, with the correct marketing, be a winner. Playing on a Friday night would attract many who work in the city, possibly including a range of hospitality packages to attract a higher yield per seat. I remember when Birmingham Bullets played at the NIA, in the Nick Nurse era, there were a number of courtside boxes which included a food and drinks package that seamed to be popular. The NIA, sorry Arena Birmingham, also has the VIP gallery lounge that could be used for hospitality packages.
As for a team name, as the club is emerging out of the COB Rockets club, Rockets would be the logical name.
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Post by LTfan on Feb 10, 2022 20:40:37 GMT
If you don’t regularly watch/listen to The BBL Show there’s a really good interview with Bob Hope about the planned Birmingham BBL franchise.
I can’t say I agree with everything he says, but I bow to his experience, and it all sounds very interesting and very promising.
He also expects the Reading Rockets application to join the league to be rejected.
It’s really worth checking out.
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Post by erj14 on Feb 10, 2022 23:20:16 GMT
If you don’t regularly watch/listen to The BBL Show there’s a really good interview with Bob Hope about the planned Birmingham BBL franchise. I can’t say I agree with everything he says, but I bow to his experience, and it all sounds very interesting and very promising. He also expects the Reading Rockets application to join the league to be rejected. It’s really worth checking out. It's quite an interesting listen and he seems very sure of himself. I was surprised he was so critical of teams who've built their arena. I think 3,000 is a decent capacity and it certainly provides everyone with a decent view. I'd be interested to see if there was much of a difference in match day revenue between a club who sells out their own venue with 3,000 in and a club that gets a crowd of 10,000 in a large arena they rent out. Bearing in mind the extra costs associated with renting an arena I'm not sure the big arena is such a good idea. |
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2022 23:34:18 GMT
If you don’t regularly watch/listen to The BBL Show there’s a really good interview with Bob Hope about the planned Birmingham BBL franchise. I can’t say I agree with everything he says, but I bow to his experience, and it all sounds very interesting and very promising. He also expects the Reading Rockets application to join the league to be rejected. It’s really worth checking out. It's quite an interesting listen and he seems very sure of himself. I was surprised he was so critical of teams who've built their arena. I think 3,000 is a decent capacity and it certainly provides everyone with a decent view. I'd be interested to see if there was much of a difference in match day revenue between a club who sells out their own venue with 3,000 in and a club that gets a crowd of 10,000 in a large arena they rent out. Bearing in mind the extra costs associated with renting an arena I'm not sure the big arena is such a good idea. I don’t think he was critical really, he said owning your own arena is the way forward and opens lots of extra revenue streams He does seem to have very lofty expectations for how many fans a Birmingham team will attract, seemingly from day one |
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Post by silverbirch on Feb 11, 2022 10:57:45 GMT
It's quite an interesting listen and he seems very sure of himself. I was surprised he was so critical of teams who've built their arena. I think 3,000 is a decent capacity and it certainly provides everyone with a decent view. I'd be interested to see if there was much of a difference in match day revenue between a club who sells out their own venue with 3,000 in and a club that gets a crowd of 10,000 in a large arena they rent out. Bearing in mind the extra costs associated with renting an arena I'm not sure the big arena is such a good idea. I don’t think he was critical really, he said owning your own arena is the way forward and opens lots of extra revenue streams He does seem to have very lofty expectations for how many fans a Birmingham team will attract, seemingly from day one At times it sounded a bit London Royals-y - promises of selling lots of tickets, employing lots of people etc |
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Post by LTfan on Feb 11, 2022 12:23:50 GMT
He said a lot of sensible things. A lot of good things. But my issue is with his view that new franchises need to be in 10,000 seater arenas from day one to allow for growth. In his case, stating the new Birmingham franchise needs to be in the NIA Arena - the third-largest indoor arena in the UK, from the very beginning is madness in my opinion.
I understand the need to allow for growth, but what's wrong with the NIA Arena being the long term goal for 5-10 years down the road? Surely it makes financial sense to start in a 3000 seater venue whilst you build a following. How much money are you going to waste hiring a 10,000 seater arena every week and only putting 2,000 people in it? Even the London City Royals started in Crystal Palace NSC, with Wembley Arena only as their long term goal.
He seems unaware, or unaccepting, the BBL franchises don't have to stay in the same venue their entire lifetime.
His idea of having a 10,000 arena from day one and giving away tickets for free every week just to fill it sounds more like the 90's BBL - all built on sand, and we know what ultimately happened.
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Post by spacejammer on Feb 11, 2022 13:19:51 GMT
He said a lot of sensible things. A lot of good things. But my issue is with his view that new franchises need to be in 10,000 seater arenas from day one to allow for growth. In his case, stating the new Birmingham franchise needs to be in the NIA Arena - the third-largest indoor arena in the UK, from the very beginning is madness in my opinion. I understand the need to allow for growth, but what's wrong with the NIA Arena being the long term goal for 5-10 years down the road? Surely it makes financial sense to start in a 3000 seater venue whilst you build a following. How much money are you going to waste hiring a 10,000 seater arena every week and only putting 2,000 people in it? Even the London City Royals started in Crystal Palace NSC, with Wembley Arena only as their long term goal. He seems unaware, or unaccepting, the BBL franchises don't have to stay in the same venue their entire lifetime. His idea of having a 10,000 arena from day one and giving away tickets for free every week just to fill it sounds more like the 90's BBL - all built on sand, and we know what ultimately happened. I need to listen to this weeks episode and might do this afternoon but from what you said I have to agree with you. If their going for to big a venue then it will go down as well as the Birmingham Knights did with the whole build it and they will come philosophy which didn't work out. Surely from past experience of how a franchise have failed 3 times and what has made the likes of other teams successful I'm establishment. They would realise its not going to be a instant success. Unless they were to have extremely rich backers like London. Then like every other team their going to have to put in the work and invest in things like the school programmes and community work as well etc... I order to grow the franchise and get it out there. |
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Post by bullets92 on Feb 11, 2022 19:26:10 GMT
He said a lot of sensible things. A lot of good things. But my issue is with his view that new franchises need to be in 10,000 seater arenas from day one to allow for growth. In his case, stating the new Birmingham franchise needs to be in the NIA Arena - the third-largest indoor arena in the UK, from the very beginning is madness in my opinion. I understand the need to allow for growth, but what's wrong with the NIA Arena being the long term goal for 5-10 years down the road? Surely it makes financial sense to start in a 3000 seater venue whilst you build a following. How much money are you going to waste hiring a 10,000 seater arena every week and only putting 2,000 people in it? Even the London City Royals started in Crystal Palace NSC, with Wembley Arena only as their long term goal. He seems unaware, or unaccepting, the BBL franchises don't have to stay in the same venue their entire lifetime. His idea of having a 10,000 arena from day one and giving away tickets for free every week just to fill it sounds more like the 90's BBL - all built on sand, and we know what ultimately happened. I admit I haven't had chance to listen to it yet, but the problem is we don't have that 3000 seat venue you mention. |
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