‘It’s been chaos, but good chaos’: Building the SLB

[LTfan]

A really good article, and interview with interim chair Vaughn Millette, on everything that's happened over the summer...

www.cityam.com/its-been-chaos-but-good-chaos-building-britains-new-basketball-league-in-weeks/ 

Some really interesting points, including confirmation Vaughn Millette will stand down from his league role when an independent successor is hired, a far more achievable goal of getting the league to the same level as other European leagues (not the second biggest league in the world!), and the role London Lions CEO (and controversially former 777 Partners vice-president) Lenz Balan played in saving the Lions by engaging the Zalgiris Group and thawing the relationship with the domestic league. 

[spacejammer]

Sept 24, 2024 10:39:21 GMT LTfan said:

A really good article, and interview with interim chair Vaughn Millette, on everything that's happened over the summer...

www.cityam.com/its-been-chaos-but-good-chaos-building-britains-new-basketball-league-in-weeks/ 

Some really interesting points, including confirmation Vaughn Millette will stand down from his league role when an independent successor is hired, a far more achievable goal of getting the league to the same level as other European leagues (not the second biggest league in the world!), and the role London Lions CEO (and controversially former 777 Partners vice-president) Lenz Balan played in saving the Lions by engaging the Zalgiris Group and thawing the relationship with the domestic league. 

A good read but I can't see the standard this year being a good as what we had last season.
That being said I am looking forward to watching a league where anyone can beat anyone and it's not as predictable aswell.

I suppose for the coverage on DAZN will be interesting to see how that pans out for them.
I'm gutted the league has left Sky Sports but I can understand why they had to do it.

I'm also glad Lions were able to stay in the league as I can't imagine a British league without a London based team.

[LTfan]

Some more from Vaughn Millette, this time courtesy of Hoopsfix on X (I think a full podcast is on its way)…

SLB Interim Chair Vaughn Millette believes the league will have distributions to clubs this season.
Thinks that will be the first time; means the league will be the most profitable it has ever been.
A real focus on the business model and sustainability.

Added if they do distributions it means they can mandate how that money is spent - ideally with a focus on reinvesting in the pathway/academies.
Sees a place in the future where any player that comes through a club's own academy will not count towards the salary cap.

Said this year he believes on average teams are spending approximately double what they spent last year on rosters (minus London).
Raising the salary floor is important.
Bringing in owners with the wealth and resources to invest, hugely important.

Has a list of over 60 potential investors trying to get involved with franchises; more demand than supply.
Have mapped out the country with each franchise area and what it might look like.
League growth defo on the horizon, but also need longer term operating license.

[irf]

Sept 24, 2024 21:21:39 GMT LTfan said:

Said this year he believes on average teams are spending approximately double what they spent last year on rosters (minus London).
Raising the salary floor is important.
Bringing in owners with the wealth and resources to invest, hugely important.

Has a list of over 60 potential investors trying to get involved with franchises; more demand than supply.
Have mapped out the country with each franchise area and what it might look like

Who is the guy saying all this?

Sounds like he's getting a bit carried away?

Why on earth would clubs be spending double on player wages this season?

I'm all for being positive and all that?

[LTfan]

Sept 24, 2024 21:34:18 GMT irf said:

Sept 24, 2024 21:21:39 GMT LTfan said:

Said this year he believes on average teams are spending approximately double what they spent last year on rosters (minus London).
Raising the salary floor is important.
Bringing in owners with the wealth and resources to invest, hugely important.

Has a list of over 60 potential investors trying to get involved with franchises; more demand than supply.
Have mapped out the country with each franchise area and what it might look like

Who is the guy saying all this?

Sounds like he's getting a bit carried away?

Why on earth would clubs be spending double on player wages this season?

I'm all for being positive and all that?

Super League Basketball Interim Chair Vaughn Millette (of Sheffield Sharks).

I'm glad I'm not the only one getting slight deja vu of the early 777 Partners interviews!
The bit about teams spending approximately double what they spent last year on rosters (minus London) did surprise me.

It all sounds very positive. But as I said, so did a lot of what 777 said initially. 

[silverbirch]

Sept 24, 2024 21:21:39 GMT LTfan said:

Some more from Vaughn Millette, this time courtesy of Hoopsfix on X (I think a full podcast is on its way)…

SLB Interim Chair Vaughn Millette believes the league will have distributions to clubs this season.
Thinks that will be the first time; means the league will be the most profitable it has ever been.
A real focus on the business model and sustainability.

Added if they do distributions it means they can mandate how that money is spent - ideally with a focus on reinvesting in the pathway/academies.
Sees a place in the future where any player that comes through a club's own academy will not count towards the salary cap.

Said this year he believes on average teams are spending approximately double what they spent last year on rosters (minus London).
Raising the salary floor is important.
Bringing in owners with the wealth and resources to invest, hugely important.

Has a list of over 60 potential investors trying to get involved with franchises; more demand than supply.
Have mapped out the country with each franchise area and what it might look like.
League growth defo on the horizon, but also need longer term operating license.

Some interesting stuff from Vaughn:

1. I believe the league provided profit distributions to clubs a few years back before 777 which were either cash payments or removed from any credit some of the clubs had
2. Please don't slip into any over reaching , overly positive, drum banging when we have just lived through a pretty turbulent last 6 months...lets all be real about the situation
3. Saying each club needs an owner with deep pockets (I'm summarising his quote about new owners) is actually an honest view in terms of realising the potential of the league and clubs. I'd love to continue an organic growth, especially in the light of the 777 deal, but clubs do need owners / investors who are happy to 'lose' some money on getting the clubs and infrastructure up to a standard

[LTfan]

His comment on profit distributions being made to clubs intrigues me. How does a brand new league already have profits to distribute to it's franchises - something that has never/rarely happened in the past?

Is it a case of the new league simply not having the opportunity to run up large debts yet?
Or has the new league received, or is about to receive, some money from somewhere - sponsorship? DAZN? But presumably that would have to be quite a significant sum of money to cover the costs of establishing the new league and having some left over to distribute to the clubs?

[irf]

Take it all with a big pinch of salt I think

Making maps of the country with all the different franchises on is fun and exciting

But actually making it happen is the very hard bit

Spending twice on much on player salaries certainly won't help with that either

[foxtrot27]

When will we learn? Sounds eerily familiar to the last yanks at 777. Profit distribution talk is laughable, when he should be talking about the metrics by which those distributions will be made. Season tickets sales, overall attendance, paid sponsorship etc. He speaks of having deep pocketed owners when there is nothing to suggest he's one and can attract them. Spending more on player salaries and haven't even filled out all the rosters or even played a game? Dunkster, where are you mate?

On the flip side, there is a league this year but its far too early to start talking about the future when the not too distant past is still fresh on the minds of fans. Also, having a long term license means nothing as its certainly hasn't helped in the past and is not a barrier to entry. Mr Vaughn needs a reality check and he will get one once the season in underway.

[tallerman]

I’m reliably told that each franchise cost a cool 2 million! If true and clubs can pay in instalments, outside of big spenders like Leicester and Newcastle, double the player salaries isn’t hard to believe. Manchester Bristol, Plymouth and Cheshire didn’t have big salary budgets at all.

The idea of a franchise area has always baffled me. Plymouth has always had Devon and Cornwall but no way were fans coming from places like Penzance. I can’t see any issue with multiple clubs in areas outside of say 30 miles.

[LTfan]

More of the same here:

www.sportspromedia.com/news/super-league-basketball-clubs-finances-ownership-bbl-vaughn-millette/

Again, this stands out to me "Millette stated that that no clubs were on “borrowed time” and that the consortium was “secure”. He also expects profits to be distributed to teams at the end of the season and said that “we’re already running a big surplus".

Don't get me wrong, if this is correct it's great news. But again, how is Super League Basketball already 'running a big surplus'? Where's the money coming from?

[blueskies99]

I’m confused (as usual) 

Nine franchises, £2m per franchise gives the SLB a pot of £18m.

How is the SLB going to make a profit, and thus return said profit to the clubs at the end of the season?

How do you arrive at the position of Riders being big spenders when their coach has already stated publicly that they will be running on a significantly reduced budget this season?

[LTfan]

Sept 25, 2024 12:36:40 GMT blueskies99 said:

I’m confused (as usual) 

Nine franchises, £2m per franchise gives the SLB a pot of £18m.

How is the SLB going to make a profit, and thus return said profit to the clubs at the end of the season?

I know, I can't quite make sense of it either.

All I can think of is - entirely hypothetical - each franchise has paid an initial sum of their £2M fee, lets say 10%, so SLB currently has £1.8M (9 X £200K) budget.
SLB doesn't believe it's going to utilise all of that £1.8M by the end of the season so will have the claimed surplus to distribute to the franchises - i.e. giving them back some of the fee they've paid off.
Either that or there's some large investment/sponsorship/cash coming from somewhere we don't know yet.

Just to reiterate, the above is entirely hypothetical, especially the numbers, and is just me brainstorming how SLB is supposedly 'already running a big surplus' of cash.
If correct, it at least demonstrates how the league plans to operate within it's means going forward (even if the 'profit' is just the franchises getting some of their own money back).

[foxtrot27]

Sept 25, 2024 13:34:44 GMT LTfan said:

Sept 25, 2024 12:36:40 GMT blueskies99 said:

I’m confused (as usual) 

Nine franchises, £2m per franchise gives the SLB a pot of £18m.

How is the SLB going to make a profit, and thus return said profit to the clubs at the end of the season?

I know, I can't quite make sense of it either.

All I can think of is - entirely hypothetical - each franchise has paid an initial sum of their £2M fee, lets say 10%, so SLB currently has £1.8M (9 X £200K) budget.
SLB doesn't believe it's going to utilise all of that £1.8M by the end of the season so will have the claimed surplus to distribute to the franchises - i.e. giving them back some of the fee they've paid off.
Either that or there's some large investment/sponsorship/cash coming from somewhere we don't know yet.

Just to reiterate, the above is entirely hypothetical, especially the numbers, and is just me brainstorming how SLB is supposedly 'already running a big surplus' of cash.
If correct, it at least demonstrates how the league plans to operate within it's means going forward (even if the 'profit' is just the franchises getting some of their own money back).

The only surplus that can be given to clubs from the league is central revenue driven i.e. sponsorship, TV rights. Paying a franchise fee only to be returned to club doesn't make sense. This is an easy exercise, once the games start, if the venues aren't full by the third month, its a bust as the only meaningful revenue is ticket sales. There will be no paid sponsorship in the beginning for a new league with no proven audience and I highly doubt DAZN paid anything. Not to be pessimistic, but realistic given we've seen and heard this story before. I would have rather hear Vaughn talk about now many season tickets have been sold and what is the league marketing plan given its a startup. Saying you'll be profitable enough to return money to club owners is a bit.......far fetched.

[SamH]

It's not really a new startup though is it? The name aside, it's basically the same league as last season, same teams and it'll be the same fans. They're not starting from scratch to build a fan base or local media coverage, it'll all be pretty much as we were. Whether it's enough though, is quite a different matter.

[tallerman]

Sept 25, 2024 12:36:40 GMT blueskies99 said:

I’m confused (as usual) 

Nine franchises, £2m per franchise gives the SLB a pot of £18m.

How is the SLB going to make a profit, and thus return said profit to the clubs at the end of the season?

How do you arrive at the position of Riders being big spenders when their coach has already stated publicly that they will be running on a significantly reduced budget this season?

Because you sign, fly in and pay players to cut them within a month due to injuries, assholes or poor performance. All that costs a lot of money, paying Mo Walker for the last 5 years to play probably 30-40 games is another big spend for little reward. Not saying Leicester are spending 150k for players but once you add up all the extras they end up paying it makes them a big spender.

But at the same time, they should be a big spender, them, caledonia and Newcastle own their arenas so should have the money to pay for better players

[erj14]

Sept 25, 2024 15:20:51 GMT tallerman said:

Sept 25, 2024 12:36:40 GMT blueskies99 said:

I’m confused (as usual) 

Nine franchises, £2m per franchise gives the SLB a pot of £18m.

How is the SLB going to make a profit, and thus return said profit to the clubs at the end of the season?

How do you arrive at the position of Riders being big spenders when their coach has already stated publicly that they will be running on a significantly reduced budget this season?

Because you sign, fly in and pay players to cut them within a month due to injuries, assholes or poor performance. All that costs a lot of money, paying Mo Walker for the last 5 years to play probably 30-40 games is another big spend for little reward. Not saying Leicester are spending 150k for players but once you add up all the extras they end up paying it makes them a big spender.

But at the same time, they should be a big spender, them, caledonia and Newcastle own their arenas so should have the money to pay for better players

I reckon both Riders and Eagles will be nearer the bottom of the spending charts for this season. Manchester, Sheffield, Cheshire and London all splashing the cash compared to them.

[tallerman]

Again, newcastle will spending a lot more than most because of the enbl. Players will receive higher wages because they're playing more games and newcastle will be paying a shed load more in travel and sorts. At least 150k more than a standard sbl team

[spacejammer]

Sept 25, 2024 16:42:20 GMT tallerman said:

Again, newcastle will spending a lot more than most because of the enbl. Players will receive higher wages because they're playing more games and newcastle will be paying a shed load more in travel and sorts. At least 150k more than a standard sbl team

I would although looking at our lack of depth I expect this team might be weaker then last seasons roster.
Which considering we finished 6th last year would be a concern going into this season.

[dexter]

Sept 25, 2024 14:17:10 GMT foxtrot27 said:

Sept 25, 2024 13:34:44 GMT LTfan said:

I know, I can't quite make sense of it either.

All I can think of is - entirely hypothetical - each franchise has paid an initial sum of their £2M fee, lets say 10%, so SLB currently has £1.8M (9 X £200K) budget.
SLB doesn't believe it's going to utilise all of that £1.8M by the end of the season so will have the claimed surplus to distribute to the franchises - i.e. giving them back some of the fee they've paid off.
Either that or there's some large investment/sponsorship/cash coming from somewhere we don't know yet.

Just to reiterate, the above is entirely hypothetical, especially the numbers, and is just me brainstorming how SLB is supposedly 'already running a big surplus' of cash.
If correct, it at least demonstrates how the league plans to operate within it's means going forward (even if the 'profit' is just the franchises getting some of their own money back).

The only surplus that can be given to clubs from the league is central revenue driven i.e. sponsorship, TV rights. Paying a franchise fee only to be returned to club doesn't make sense. This is an easy exercise, once the games start, if the venues aren't full by the third month, its a bust as the only meaningful revenue is ticket sales. There will be no paid sponsorship in the beginning for a new league with no proven audience and I highly doubt DAZN paid anything. Not to be pessimistic, but realistic given we've seen and heard this story before. I would have rather hear Vaughn talk about now many season tickets have been sold and what is the league marketing plan given its a startup. Saying you'll be profitable enough to return money to club owners is a bit.......far fetched.

If it is true that there will be a surplus there must be an income the BBL didn't have. Maybe DAZN are paying for SLB. Who knows what strategy they have to get more British viewers. They could be positioning themselves to carve out a niche in the market for a sport that could get much bigger with a bit of investment.