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Post by irf on May 8, 2023 8:19:24 GMT
Even more important than Rob Paternostro is the role played by Kevin Routledge, as long as he remains interested and able to do his work in the background the club will continue to thrive. However finding someone with the vision, ability and integrity to fill his role when he steps down will be very difficult. Spot on |
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Post by erj14 on May 9, 2023 10:25:16 GMT
As an Eagles fan yes that is exactly what happens. And if you think it's bad now wait until more long term players leave/retire, Rob leaves and you loose a major sponsor. Losing long term players really doesn't worry me in the slightest. Geno's departure and the way it happened did set us back this season but he was exceptional. We've seen plenty of important, long serving players (Drew, Tyler, AT, Jamell, etc.) come and go at Riders over the years and it's never proven a major obstacle to success. Rob leaving would be significant. And I do think it's conceivable that if we aren't able to kick on as a club, he might decide in a few years that he's gone as far as he can with Riders and look for more exciting opportunities elsewhere. So long as Rob remains at the club I think we'll continue to do as well as anyone in terms of getting the best out of what resources we have. But if those resources don't improve and we aren't able to take a meaningful step forward, I do fear we may soon start sliding backwards. The days of us being able to basically stand still as a club and still hoover up trophies left, right and centre are clearly over. Seven years we've been at Morningside now. Won 12-13 trophies over that period. And for all that domestic success, one 0-6 effort in Europe Cup is all we've been able to muster. If that really is the best an organically grown British basketball club with a normal-ish budget can do then God help us. Feel like you're being harsh on the Riders there. I think their forays in to Europe took guts and showed where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe, for clubs that don't have sugar daddy owners at least. |
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Post by LTfan on May 9, 2023 12:00:19 GMT
Losing long term players really doesn't worry me in the slightest. Geno's departure and the way it happened did set us back this season but he was exceptional. We've seen plenty of important, long serving players (Drew, Tyler, AT, Jamell, etc.) come and go at Riders over the years and it's never proven a major obstacle to success. Rob leaving would be significant. And I do think it's conceivable that if we aren't able to kick on as a club, he might decide in a few years that he's gone as far as he can with Riders and look for more exciting opportunities elsewhere. So long as Rob remains at the club I think we'll continue to do as well as anyone in terms of getting the best out of what resources we have. But if those resources don't improve and we aren't able to take a meaningful step forward, I do fear we may soon start sliding backwards. The days of us being able to basically stand still as a club and still hoover up trophies left, right and centre are clearly over. Seven years we've been at Morningside now. Won 12-13 trophies over that period. And for all that domestic success, one 0-6 effort in Europe Cup is all we've been able to muster. If that really is the best an organically grown British basketball club with a normal-ish budget can do then God help us. Feel like you're being harsh on the Riders there. I think their forays in to Europe took guts and showed where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe, for clubs that don't have sugar daddy owners at least. Where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe? Let's be honest, some European teams have sugar daddy owners too. So now that a couple of British teams also have sugar daddy owners, why shouldn't we complete? |
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Post by erj14 on May 9, 2023 14:36:35 GMT
I'm not saying they shouldn't compete, they absolutely should. For me what Glasgow and London are doing isn't a realistic picture of how well basketball is doing in this country. I'm always more interested in the teams who are spending what they earn.
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Post by LTfan on May 9, 2023 14:57:49 GMT
I'm not saying they shouldn't compete, they absolutely should. For me what Glasgow and London are doing isn't a realistic picture of how well basketball is doing in this country. I'm always more interested in the teams who are spending what they earn. That's fair enough, all I was saying is that I think what we're seeing in the UK now is something that's been happening in Europe for a while. There are teams without big money backers, and there are teams with big money backers. So, to me, it's only right we imitate other European leagues and the UK teams with big money backers compete in the likes of Euroleague, Euro Cup, Champions League and Europe Cup. Whether what's happening is right or not is another discussion, but I know Spanish basketball giants continue to deliver unprofitable numbers - biggest culprit being Barcelona. So what's happening in the UK isn't a unique situation, and I think we should keep that in mind when speaking about 'where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe' - because other countries are doing exactly the same thing. |
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Post by erj14 on May 9, 2023 15:51:10 GMT
I'm not saying they shouldn't compete, they absolutely should. For me what Glasgow and London are doing isn't a realistic picture of how well basketball is doing in this country. I'm always more interested in the teams who are spending what they earn. That's fair enough, all I was saying is that I think what we're seeing in the UK now is something that's been happening in Europe for a while. There are teams without big money backers, and there are teams with big money backers. So, to me, it's only right we imitate other European leagues and the UK teams with big money backers compete in the likes of Euroleague, Euro Cup, Champions League and Europe Cup. Whether what's happening is right or not is another discussion, but I know Spanish basketball giants continue to deliver unprofitable numbers - biggest culprit being Barcelona. So what's happening in the UK isn't a unique situation, and I think we should keep that in mind when speaking about 'where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe' - because other countries are doing exactly the same thing. Yes, that makes sense. There are always going to be outliers skewing the overall picture. |
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Post by Stephen Abootman on May 10, 2023 17:19:34 GMT
Feel like you're being harsh on the Riders there. I think their forays in to Europe took guts and showed where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe, for clubs that don't have sugar daddy owners at least. I'm not going to humour the idea that Riders gave Europe a go this season. We didn't. We've attempted it once, back in 2018. And I wouldn't say it was a stunningly impressive effort really. Didn't win a game. Recruitment was weak. Crowds, particularly for the last two games were poor. Don't think we did a particularly good job of promoting it. There were a few factors beyond our control that conspired against us a bit but there's also a hell of a lot we could have done better ourselves. I really don't think it would be too difficult for us to improve upon that effort, if we ever do decide to try again. The only vaguely positive thing I can say about it really was that even though we went winless we did have a real chance to win two or three of those games. That's about as competitive as we had a right to be really given the talent level of that team. Douse and Larsson were regular starters, Lascelles played some pretty significant minutes. It was far from the strongest Riders roster ever put together. I reckon last year's team could potentially have made a much better fist of it... Won a few games, with a reasonable draw perhaps even make the second round. I'm not asking us to do a Lions here. I'm not suggesting we should be trying to rub shoulders with Europe's biggest and richest clubs. But if the likes of Kapfenberg Bulls can find a way to participate regularly in Europe Cup, I don't think it should be beyond the capacity of Britain's best sustainably run clubs to do the same. If that's some hopelessly unrealistic, head in the clouds kind of expectation then I find it pretty pathetic I'm afraid. |
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Post by erj14 on May 10, 2023 21:49:05 GMT
Feel like you're being harsh on the Riders there. I think their forays in to Europe took guts and showed where British Basketball really is in comparison to Europe, for clubs that don't have sugar daddy owners at least. I'm not going to humour the idea that Riders gave Europe a go this season. We didn't. We've attempted it once, back in 2018. And I wouldn't say it was a stunningly impressive effort really. Didn't win a game. Recruitment was weak. Crowds, particularly for the last two games were poor. Don't think we did a particularly good job of promoting it. There were a few factors beyond our control that conspired against us a bit but there's also a hell of a lot we could have done better ourselves. I really don't think it would be too difficult for us to improve upon that effort, if we ever do decide to try again. The only vaguely positive thing I can say about it really was that even though we went winless we did have a real chance to win two or three of those games. That's about as competitive as we had a right to be really given the talent level of that team. Douse and Larsson were regular starters, Lascelles played some pretty significant minutes. It was far from the strongest Riders roster ever put together. I reckon last year's team could potentially have made a much better fist of it... Won a few games, with a reasonable draw perhaps even make the second round. I'm not asking us to do a Lions here. I'm not suggesting we should be trying to rub shoulders with Europe's biggest and richest clubs. But if the likes of Kapfenberg Bulls can find a way to participate regularly in Europe Cup, I don't think it should be beyond the capacity of Britain's best sustainably run clubs to do the same. If that's some hopelessly unrealistic, head in the clouds kind of expectation then I find it pretty pathetic I'm afraid. I agree, it wasn't an all guns blazing foot in the water at all. In the moment, I remember feeling pretty excited by how close run some of their games were. But also pretty disappointed by how poorly attended the games looked from the footage. Overall I thought it was a pretty gutsy move to do it in the first place, when it's not going to provide any sort of immediate returns money wise, and is going to be a net negative financially speaking. I think the biggest hurdle is trying to create a culture of people attending mid week basketball. Even the best supported clubs don't seem to be able to attract a decent crowd, I'm not really sure what the answer is. I love going to Eagles games, but if they ever started playing in Europe I'd struggle to justify attending 10 or so more games a season, especially midweek. I'm rambling, but I just think playing I Europe is a really difficult thing to justify unless you can absorb losses in the way Glasgow and London can. As a side note, I agree what Riders did in Europe this year seemed a bit half baked. It seemed like something to try and placate Geno more than a proper go in Europe. |
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Post by dexter on May 24, 2023 0:47:15 GMT
I’ve just discovered there’s a women’s ENBL. It’s called the EWBL. www.ewbl.eu/ |
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jt
Sixth Man
Posts: 219
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Post by jt on Jun 23, 2023 9:18:04 GMT
The Eagles have just announced they'll be joining the Flyers in the ENBL!
4 teams playing Europe games next year is great!
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Post by D44 on Jun 23, 2023 10:55:38 GMT
The Eagles have just announced they'll be joining the Flyers in the ENBL! 4 teams playing Europe games next year is great! That is really interesting news. Glad the Eagles are showing some ambition, particularly given every home game is pretty much a guaranteed sell out. Let's just hope our roster is significantly better and deeper than last season otherwise it could be completely embarrassing but being a miserable pessimist aside going to enjoy the extra games and hopefully allows us to be in for a higher calibre of players. Can only assume this is related to the announcement of a new sponsor yesterday who must be footing the bill after not really having a proper sponsor for a few years. |
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Post by tony on Jun 23, 2023 11:15:50 GMT
I would imagine some top players coming to Newcastle 😀🏀
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Post by Stephen Abootman on Jun 23, 2023 13:48:35 GMT
I absolutely think that European basketball should be in Newcastle's future. But given how desperately the club has struggled to put a competitive product on the floor in recent years, I find the decision to participate in this competition, now, more than a little surprising. I'm pretty sure that very, very few BBL fans had even heard of the ENBL prior to the Flyers announcement. I certainly hadn't. And I'm not at all convinced that a bunch of next level players are going to be queueing up to sign with Eagles and Flyers now. Given that Flyers are coming off a pretty successful season and have a venue that isn't suitable for the better recognised European competitions, I can understand them wanting to give this a go. But the priority for Eagles right now must surely just be to get back to where they belong domestically. And I reckon participating in this could be more of a hindrance than a help. Meanwhile in Leicester...  Call me biased if you will but in my view Leicester is the one BBL club outside London that absolutely should have it's sights seriously set on Europe right now. I'll be crossing my fingers (but not holding my breath) for some positive news on that front in the near future. If damn near half the league is participating in some sort of European competition next season and we aren't I'm afraid I'm going to get even more jaded and miserable. I apologize in advance. |
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Post by mac on Jun 23, 2023 15:08:34 GMT
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Post by eagles18000 on Jun 23, 2023 19:16:39 GMT
Eagles decisions have always been based around the business not the on court situation.
When winning a lot the infrastructure (venue, finances etc) wasn't there to go into European competition so they didnt.
Now the business is seeing the benefit of the arena re crowd numbers and sponsors (and in reality its only 2 years since covid that they have been able to properly monetise the building and its happened in spite of results on the court not because of) then one assumes the economic conditions for entry - and its only 7 games minimum - are more favourable.
if home games are making money (only had 19 last year) and you can increase that number substantially - (probably more like 25 this year) then the business case makes more sense.
and re winning stuff in the bbl : pretty clear that for the foreseeable everyone is playing for second .............
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Post by spacejammer on Jun 23, 2023 21:29:12 GMT
Well I'm speechless but also over the moon that we are going to tackle Europe.
I'll admit I don't think we are quite ready and given our coach is only in his 2nd season in the League and how we just scrapped the playoffs.
But I'm excited and hope that we will look to recruit a deep bench next season as we are certainly going to need it if we're going to manage both the BBL and Europe as well as the travel abroad.
Although given his GB experience I'm sure Stetuel will be no stranger to the travel and probably covering a lot of air miles this season under both roles.
With 4 teams now playing in European competition again I'm starting to wonder if 777's plan is actually working. And in a way I would compare it to the famous scientists Charles Darwins Orgins of Species but in a basketball sense.
With London now growing stronger and being so high calibre.
I wonder if this has encouraged more teams to aim and take the plunge into Europe even on a smaller stage in order to keep up and evolve with the current standard of the game.
Either way I will he excited to see what this season brings and hope whatever happens we atleast improve in the BBL and climb a little higher in the league.
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Post by reallyoldfeenixfan2 on Jun 23, 2023 23:50:23 GMT
I would imagine some top players coming to Newcastle 😀🏀 .......and winning. |
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